Why the Heal ability needs to be better than healing potions

Heya, I’ve been thinking after all of the exciting changes that has happened in Vesteria like the guilhalls and now an upcoming ability rework, I wanted to discuss something about the Heal ability.

Heal is at level 10 is a 500 heal with a 4 second cooldown, at level 9 it is pretty much the same thing.

Right now, this game is really easy, when you lose 1k hp out of maybe 2000 or maybe even 1.2k, all you have to do is eat a sub, which takes less time with the only downside being that you can not attack or sprint.

It heals 1k HP and it doesn’t take long to even eat it. It drops out of common enemies and is sold cheaply if you want to be pretty much unkillable.

I am suggesting that we need to make heal better, perhaps a bigger burst of heal (1000 HP instantly every 4 seconds?)

Along with that, I am also suggesting that potions become more rare and more difficult to get.

In a dungeon, let us assume that it is not as easy as an SQR. A new dungeon in the Whispering Dunes that is difficult and requires cooperation and teamwork to finish.

If you are looking for a party, you would be seeking for:

  • AoE
  • DPS
  • Survivability

However, this heal ability is not enough to take care of the survivability that people seek. In fact, all you need is probably a stack of Subs and you’ll be fine.

People should see a significant increase in dungeon survivability if they have someone with the heal ability in their dungeon.

In simple terms, potions should not take care of the survivability entirely. There is no way that it makes sense that some warrior that has high health already and defense should be able to just chug potions and be a god because of their money spending.

The goal that I am trying to share is that people should be using Heal to heal others in order to help face against whatever difficult challenges the future Vesteria has to play. Right now I don’t think its effective, and that it should not be as effective as potions.

(Basically, if I were to put you in the situation where you have low HP, you would go to the person who has the heal ability rather than drinking rare HP potions.)

Concerns? Share them please.

I really like this! I also completely agree on the points your making with the current game.

I think potions that generate your mana and health are overall quite clustered.

Would you want to impose a change on how mana is generated as well? Because there must be at least a hundred conversations on how that could be achieved.

I mean, why can’t potion consumption times be proportionate to how much they provide? Currently in the game potions are necessary due to how poor the natural regeneration of health is.

That is an insane amount of health generation, no one will ever die. That would be considerably worse than the current situation.

I actually had an afterthought earlier today over how often potions are depended on though, there needs to be a change but this isn’t the solution.

Hm, I was actually thinking that high tier HP potions (Subs) should be more rare while potions like orange potions should stay as common as it is.

It will stay an option, but if you want to carry game breaking hp potions, you will need to pay a price and some players won’t be willing to invest so much on potions for a simple adventure and save it for a dungeon that may potentially be difficult.

An insane amount of health generation? lol

I’m sure you’re aware that

  1. Mighty Subs heal you for 1,000 HP
  2. Heal is 4 seconds cooldown, it doesn’t take you 4 seconds to drink/eat a HP consumable.
  3. This ability is coming from people that want to be support, either they wont have enough points invested into heal for it to matter enough (Hybrid of support & damage) or enough points to make it so they’re pretty much the support class.

What I’m saying seems broke, and I am aware of it too.

However, currently we heal 500 HP every 4 seconds

Would you rather seek a Cleric if you lost 1000 HP or would you rather just eat a sub?

Cleric should not be useless.

I have suggestions to make potions less useful in dungeons but still useful overall

Potions Less Useful in Dungeons
  1. Increase potion recharge time
  2. Lock potions
  3. Decrease hp restored by potion
Heal is More Useful in Dungeons
  1. Buff heal in dungeons
  • increase heal amount
  • decrease cooldown

There should be an easier way to use heal, rather than going to the injured and heal them, while probably committing suicide because no cleric is going to build tank as they cannot do any damage without spending 2/3 of their points to INT (or 1/3 INT and the other DEX).
However cleric can save like 1/3 of their money by not using any healing items, that is really profiting for those who maxed out this skills first
Healing using bolt is way more easier, especially if there is a homing effect, but it would reduce the effectiveness of healing a group.
Hope berezaa can figure out a way to rework this skill, as cleric’s only major use is resurrecting.

also why do people call a cleric trash for not resurrecting them, my rez is on cooldown wat

1 Like

heal is infinite and you can spam it at very little cost
plus you can only eat another consumable around 1 second after you finish the first one

heal is a pocket heal that you can spam
I’d say it’s fine now

clerics aren’t supposed to be the most needed class in the game
just because it gives something doesn’t mean it should be the best way to get said thing

I get that heal is useless when people have a ton of health and it should be % based
but it’s still really good and crazy cheap

subs may not cost much
but if you have a lot of hp you’ll be going through them in seconds and then you’ll have to buy more at port or kill mokotuaa which is a lot of time

heal does need a buff which will probably come in the ability update
but currently it’s pretty good

I’m saying that clerics should be perferable to eating subs.

Right now it is not, here are some reasons why heal is worse than subs currently:

  • It heals 500 hp every 4 seconds, subs faster.
  • You only get healed if you are next to someone with max heal.
  • If you do have max heal, you lack offensive abilities so survivability should compensate.

If you want to survive a hard dungeon or whatever, the subs we have currently can just lead people to saying: “We need more people with attack, you having Heal is useless to our team since we only need damage.”

It seems good simply because it is an ability, but remember the cooldown, the lack of offensive abilities, and the inconvenience if you seek health from someone with the Heal ability.

It costs 34 mana at max, which is cheap, but just by having this ability, you’ve thrown away a chance at having more offensive abilities.

There’s no reason to make Clerics useless by having a better alternative.

Honestly I think a small adjustment to heal would be to increase its radius and have it restore 30% OR 500 of the targets’ HP.

Another thing would also be to adjust the Mighty Sub’s consumption time to be longer than other potions. You don’t really eat an entire sandwich in 2 seconds anyway.

I never liked the idea of heal restoring a percentage of the target’s HP since it does not make you feel powerful.

If I went up to a level 1 or whatever and assumed that he had 100 HP

If he has a total of 5/100 HP, I would want to completely heal him no trouble.

The problem right now is that heal is really just something for yourself.

Increasing the radius doesn’t really help much if after all, you still have to be close. (unless you’re literally going to suggest a flare range)

I meant that it would restore whichever is higher. Would be both helpful to knights and people with low max HP.

And as for an increased, radius, I say that increasing it by 50% would be effective which would end up being half of flare’s range.

Every 4 seconds meaning if you had 2.5k HP and you had 100 HP left and went to a cleric, it would take 20 seconds to fully heal.

What if I ate a sub?

You’d have to make have the sub take 8 seconds to eat to make it worse than Heal.

Now, by increasing the radius, it creates a gameplay which lets you “space out” in a game where it requires your focus. All you have to do is click the heal ability whenever the cooldown is finished and you’d inevitably heal your teammates just because of the radius.

(Why was stamina added and why did the hold click basic attack get removed?)

If you allow for more active, fun gameplay, it’d be a 1000 HP every 4 seconds which is still worse if you just ate subs but the heal is instant, so people would seek not just a party full of damage but a party with people that may have the Heal ability.

it takes around 2 seconds to eat a sub and 1 second before you can eat another

yet during that 2 second window you can’t run or jump unless you want to cancel the animation have to wait 3 seconds to eat the sub again

I get that heal should be better but people shouldn’t need a subclass in order to do a dungeon
it should make it easier and less stressful not a requirement

subs aren’t good enough to replace heal
you have to go restock on them and you have a lot of delay while eating them

sure cleric heal is slower
but you can just jump and use it then be able to move while you land
it makes you a lot more mobile and able to keep your hp topped off while in a combat intense scenario

if the level cap is 50 then it’s fine how it is, maybe heal 1.25 more heal for warrior so it’s better at healing warriors, and maybe some more radius so you can be more efficient with your healing but I think that heal is fine how it is

if cleric is supposed to be a healer subclass (which it’s not) then you can go around blinking to people and healing people instead of going dex bomb and focusing on damage.

cleric isn’t supposed to be a main dps class either
it’s a mage subclass that instead of going for more damaging abilities decided to gain support and utility abilites.

Indeed, if you were in danger 100% of the time.

As a cleric, the heal is too slow to tank damage like a knight.

However, when you eat subs, you can walk.

The Heal ability will soon be seperated and mages would freely be able to invest in it.

There should be a way to go for a support pathway, so you should be able to upgrade it to max. Indeed is Cleric not intended to be a full support.

It’s not effective for healing since subs are faster, and no one wants to jump into battle if their health is low.

Ok, a number of things:

  1. Heal is infinite, consumables are not
  2. Don’t forget Regeneration from the Adventurer Skill Book. At level 5, it’s actually kinda good (as a max lvl Ranger, it healed more than 100HP/tick for me)
  3. Mighty Subs are not all that easy to come by. Though most people say they are, that is RNG. The only truly reliable way to obtain them is at the bar shop in Port Fidelio, where they are 2.2S each (in my experience, one of the most expensive consumables in game). Don’t forget, Mighty Subs only stack to 16, while Orange Potions (300 HP) and Magenta Potions (600 HP, T3 Guild Hall only) stack to 32.
  4. You are forgetting Flare entirely. A Cleric can get several million EXP just for going and casting Flare in SQR: once to clear the Spiderlings in the first parkour, once to clear the Spiderlings in Clear the Spiderlings, easy couple mil. Also, they still have the default mage abilities, Thundercall and Multibomb are OP.
  5. There are not always Clerics nearby, in fact, due to the percieved low offensive capabilities of the subclass, they are quite rare indeed.
  6. Clerics can wear Archaeomagus Robes and Hat, making them somewhat tanky with 45 VIT (nowhere near as much as a Knight, but they’re still decently strong).
  1. You need to invest in heal ability.

  2. It takes mana, and that takes mana potions. Attacking and managing your survivability with mana. (Mana potions are consumed)

They stack to 16, but they are cheap. You think they are expensive, but really they aren’t. They heal for a huge amount of health, meaning you aren’t going to use an entire stack unless you keep taking damage over and over.

Bandit camps in my experience gives 80-150s if solo’d.

Yes, but you also have to invest in flare. You’re forgetting:

  1. 30 second cooldown
  2. Sorcerer has a better alternative
  3. Thundercall is not OP
  4. Multibomb is every mage’s thing, but the problem is that clerics do not have any good attacks except flare, which really sucks if you have tons of experience as Cleric. (Honestly, 30 seconds is actually a lot of time)

why would i be a cleric if my heal sucked

mages*

That doesn’t make the heal ability’s current power justified, however.

Sorcerer might have better DPS, but remember that Cleric is a support class, meaning that high damage isn’t its best. Also, Clerics rely heavily on base mage abilities, whereas Sorcerer and Warlock tend to branch off. Also, as max (lvl 49) cleric, you’ve got just enough points to max resurrect and either flare or heal (flare is decent because damage and healing) and get 9 in the other.
Also, healing potions are presumably prepared over a decently long course of time (akin to 3 weeks of real-world time), and so they can be invested with more power than average skills can.
MP regenerates fairly fast, and Mana Elixirs are easy to get if you have T3 Guild Hall.

The reason why I wanted heal buffed was simply to make them viable as a support class. It’s justified to say that someone with the heal ability (that can heal multiple people) would deal less damage than someone who doesn’t.

Yes, but leveling up a Cleric is also a thing. I’m not an idiot, I wouldn’t mention that you have to invest in these points for no reason.

Along with leveling up with the current system to make heal or even flare (which sucks EVEN at max level with the 30 second cooldown), phase 3 according to Berezaa would yeet subclasses and then leave us with more choice.

If you wanted the Heal ability, you’d have to invest points on it. Making Heal weak makes it absolutely pointless to even invest on points for heal when you could have just invested on attack abilities.

It needs to be worthwhile. You should have the ability to be a viable support, keeping your teammates alive to compensate for not being the main person clearing out the enemies.

I agree, Heal is worthless. But still, healing potions are just that much more common than Clerics, and Clerics have resurrect for a reason.

They’re about keeping their teammates alive. It just doesn’t sound right when you’re only useful when someone dies, and only one can be revived.

When (hopefully, according to The Perfect Dungeon) the dungeon releases, I expect that people might want a cleric in their team for their survivability in exchange for the speed they are able to finish the dungeon.

Doing the dungeon should be hard, so a cleric would help survivability but a full glass cannon party can technecially win if they kill everything fast enough.