The Alpha Alliance for Territory Domination

i see what you did there nerd

sok gang is better anyways :moyai:

uh ok.

dont click guild post for serenity

no, you definitely should.

With this new alliance, provided that Guild Territories are implemented as stated in this post, then it will be pretty much impossible to capture territory that the Alpha Alliance (which I will until the end of this post abbreviate as “the AA”) has already captured. Furthermore, it’s highly unlikely that any guilds will be born in order to capture these territories as proposed. Here’s why.

The AA is comprised of arguably the most powerful and influential guilds in Vesteria. PotM is the longest standing, most recognised and most populated guild of every guild in the game. Seaside Syndicate is a guild comprised of members that are extremely good at combat. Serenity is of course the first guild to ever be made in-game, and contains a large amount of powerful community members, including testers and moderators.

Judging from this line in the post, it seems as though the AA believes that by combining strength it’ll encourage more competition from other guilds, and potentially spark new alliances. This would create large battles that would be difficult but rewarding to win, as evidenced by this line:

Allow me to explain how instead of creating an incentive for other guilds to work together to take over guild territories, you’ve created an impenetrable oligarchy which forces smaller guilds to disband and/or join the AA.

First off, let’s discuss why no one is going to create guild alliances to go up against the AA. It’s because you’d need to be an absolute fool to try to power through the most dedicated, best players in Vesteria. Let’s go through the scenario that a guild alliance is created in an attempt to rival the AA. First, what experienced players would rather join a random, unknown and unproven guild in order to attempt to overthrow quite literally a group of the most powerful players if instead they could join the group of powerful players and gain all the benefits they’d be working for? It doesn’t make any logical sense to join a small guild that is attempting to overthrow the largest guild alliance in the game in order to get benefits you could already get by joining it.

But let’s say that somehow some small guilds manage to form an alliance of experienced players. They try to raid the territory. A territory occupied by players who have golden equipment and equipment blessed by the Orb (no longer possible). The issue is that with this alliance, all of the experienced players and all of their weapons fall on one side, and the chances of getting golden equipment is extremely rare, something that no regular players would do. So yeah, the small guild gets trampled. What would happen after that is debatable, but I see it going two ways. Either the guild disbands completely, or the guild is merged with one of the bigger guilds in the AA. Either way, the AA either wins and potentially becomes more powerful.

Second, let’s discuss why it’s highly likely that no one will even bother trying to raid guild territories. Allow me to take a quote from the “Guild Territory Discussion” topic I linked at the beginning of this post.

There is no actual benefit to taking guild territories aside from a few roleplaying areas. No guild aside from extremely large guilds or guild alliances would have any use for this place. That’s why the AA is really the only group currently (aside from one of the individual parts of the AA) that could even really use a guild hall for any purpose. So you’re not going to be seeing a lot of competition unless some incentive is put in place. Sure, you can brag that a guild alliance you’re a part of has all of the guild territories, but that’s about it.

Let’s say that actual incentive such as items or money were to be added to these guild territories though. Well, you’ve now just created a state in the game where players are forced to join these guilds if they want to get free items, and you’ve made the biggest guild in the game even larger. So clearly, this wouldn’t work.

We’ve now reached a point where you both need an incentive to capture these guild territories but you can’t have an incentive to capture these guild territories. Let me provide a proposal now, though this would have to be done from the guild currently in power of the territory at the time and would be completely optional for the guild.

The guild in power of the territory puts up a bounty for people who can successfully take the guild territory from them. This bounty could range anywhere from a few Mushcoins to Cursed Scrolls and everything in between. The issue becomes how you’d divide this bounty up within the guild, and I haven’t got any bright solutions for that one since there could be problems during every stage of the transaction.

So at best, it would have to be players motivating other players to actually try to stir some competition. But as I previously said, the AA is pretty much impossible to beat, so unless members of the guilds in the AA start betraying their guilds and make other guilds, (which is highly unlikely I’d think) the AA is going to be on top pretty much forever.

So as I’ve explained here, the AA is essentially an oligarchy that does not spawn competition and instead essentially forces players who are looking to play in these Guild Territories to either join a guild in the AA or only be able to explore the very outskirts of these maps for fear of being killed by members of the AA. If this was the actual goal of the AA, congratulations, you’ve created a really solid way to expand your guilds through force if people want to experience the entirety of the game. But please do not advertise the alliance as a way to “promote competition”, because at best it encourages weak competition, and at worst it doesn’t encourage competition at all.

No TL;DR this time. After all, most guild leaders seem to really enjoy writing up these massive guild posts, so you should be perfectly fine reading something of the same length.

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If people were to betray, others from the same guild would probably follow so there’s no need to betray if we’re already going to claim territories. We definitely thought of the rest and yes, we’re really into growing our guilds even more, but it might be unhealthy for Vesteria. Apologies.

Git gud

Altho i do like the idea AA is an oligarchy thats kinda metal

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Bawk! (Git Gud)

:heart:

You have very fair criticisms, and to be honest you’re not wrong. But It doesn’t force players to join the guilds in it (only open guild is PoTM). Instead it pushes more people to band together to actually face this alliance though would require a lot of planning and organization. Chances are there isn’t really much smaller guilds can do against the alliance, but if even a small group of people made a guild under the guise of defeating the AA I think it would be entirely possible. For the most part, you are right though.

we’re actually going a little more private, so most Order applications won’t be accepted unless you actually have something to bring into the guild.

I love you now

Thanks to everyone who took the time to read my post and reply.

First off, “Git gud” doesn’t apply here, and let me explain why.

While it is possible for anyone to go out and get golden equipment, it’s extremely time consuming and difficult since you need to either use only Cursed Scrolls (best chance but large chance to destroy your weapon or the upgrade to fail, or the upgrade it does apply not being useful), a combination of Cursed Scrolls and Ancient Scrolls, or only Ancient Scrolls (very very low chance, not even worth talking about). Because of this, a user would first need to acquire at least seven Cursed Scrolls or Ancient Scrolls, or a combination of the two that adds up to seven. Then, you need to have an extremely large amount of luck in order to have all upgrades actually apply. I’ve created a table previously that shows the odds of this, and I’ll post it again here since this topic seems a bit more active.

# of Cursed Scrolls # of Ancient Scrolls Chance of Working (approx.)
7 0 2.8%
6 1 0.466%
5 2 0.077%
4 3 0.013%
3 4 0.002%
2 5 0.00036%
1 6 0.00006%
0 7 0.00001%

Here you can see that the maximum chance you can have for having a gold-tier equipment piece is 2.8%, and that’s with full Cursed Scroll provided they all apply a decent upgrade at worst. If your equipment piece is destroyed by a Cursed Scroll, you need to go out and find another clean version of your equipment piece and replace all the Cursed Scrolls you used just to be able to try again. Furthermore, since Holy Scrolls are not out yet (aside from the one that berezaa gave away for free at the drop party), if one of the scrolls fails then you also need to restart the whole process.

Essentially, if you are not astronomically lucky and play for a pretty long period of time, you have no chance of getting golden equipment.

You might be questioning why golden equipment is necessary. To an extent, it’s not provided that you have invested your stat points better or have better equipment than the golden equipment of the person you’re fighting. Nevertheless, when fighting multiple people with golden-tier equipment (as you would be if you were to take on the AA) then you would certainly need equivalent equipment. Essentially, if your guild is not comprised of people with golden-tier equipment and a lot of experience in Vesteria, then you have no chance against the AA, since the majority of their members have exactly that.

Now, on to the more specific criticism (thank you Skull for providing actual criticism)

As I mentioned, even with a new alliance of smaller guilds, they have no chance to defeat the powerhouse alliance that is the AA. The AA contains the most experienced players with the best weapons, and so the majority of players not in the AA could not stand up to it, even as a group. Furthermore, you’ve got to consider that there would be no point for experienced users to join a group against the AA if their only goal is to be able to use the territory, because it would be way easier just to join PotM or apply to Seaside Syndicate (i don’t actually know if they accept applications or if its an invitation type thing like Serenity but the PotM point still stands).

If the goal was simply to take down the AA, then good luck with that since I doubt the people who want to take down guilds in the AA outnumber the people in the guilds in the AA.

Uuh Ggh kinda cute

We have good gear but none of us have gold equipment I think. I know what you are trying to say and it is true you need good gear and skill to take AA on.

wu

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Hey there~

hi dave


guild territories be like

Bawk! (Game isn’t about math it’s about gitting Gud scrub)

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